Daily Rotten Forum Experience

From: kennybob [Redneck Gay-Guy]
Date: 1-May-2006 14:58

From: brainspore [Brainspore]
Date: 1-May-2006 12:33

HISTORY is racist. Next someone will ask to stop teaching the history of the American Presidency since they were all rich white christian men.
****************************************************************************
What bugs me are these idiots who want to erase Thomas Jefferson and George Washington's names from public school buildings because they owned slaves.
I wonder if they also want to tear up the Declaration of Independence because Jefferson wrote it. You cannot judge historical events based on modern PC bullshit etiquette!

From: archemedesrex [(They Call Me Dok)]
Date: 1-May-2006 16:22

I just wanna see the goddamn woodcut.

From: mcgyver [Steve]
Date: 1-May-2006 16:42

Ok, now that everything else has been fucked up by all the politically correct do gooders now they're attacking history. So you will hear no more about slave traders, the KKK, Australian colonial history, any of the many wars over the ages, and even Al Queda (aren't they racist against the western world?).

So forget history, forget current world events, just fucking forget everything!

From: azrael
Date: 1-May-2006 17:33

Well the Japs created some of the worst atrocities of all time. Fucking Japs piss me off. However I like fucking japanese women though, is this odd?

From: duster [duster]
Date: 1-May-2006 17:51

"They have MIT's strongest support," she said. "The use of the images as part of the course is not an endorsement of the events. This is a scholarly course. It's the free exploration of ideas."

Exactly.

If I was the teacher, no way would I have apologized. It's an image of history on a history course webpage. History courses teach about events that happened, good or bad. To any offended people: DEAL WITH IT! Dumbasses.

This is America, we encourage the free expression of ideas here. If you don't like that, maybe you should go to a place that's a little more into censorship (hmm... like China!).

From: scumbagjunkie [junkiescumbag]
Date: 1-May-2006 18:06

Just to clarify, my request for context above meant that this story is worthless without seeing what the picture actually looked like. The beef that the Chinese Student Assoc. put out there smells more like bull. I think they're just bent because one of the profs is Japanese. Inter-Asian prejudices are some of the most intense.

Intense...

From: themedicated [The Medicated]
Date: 1-May-2006 18:30

I agree with the idea that this is REAL history...it's what really happened. Tough shit, deal with it. If you can't take it, don't further your education, find a cult to hide in so they can screen what you read, and make sure you drink the fucking Kool-Aid.

From: canadianguy [CanadianGuy]
Date: 1-May-2006 18:40

I'm getting tired of that 'R' word. Just because they don't like the events in history, (their side lost and got beheaded), has nothing to do with racism today. But it is history,...just whitewash everything and no one will really know what happened yesterday, let alone a hundred years ago. Victor always gets the spoils, and puts their own spin on the recording of events.

From: dwharbin [dwharbin]
Date: 1-May-2006 19:15

If your racist decapitation fits,,,,,

From: brainspore [Brainspore]
Date: 1-May-2006 19:39

From: kennybob [Redneck Gay-Guy]
Date: 1-May-2006 14:58

From: brainspore [Brainspore]
Date: 1-May-2006 12:33

HISTORY is racist. Next someone will ask to stop teaching the history of the American Presidency since they were all rich white christian men.
****************************************************************************
What bugs me are these idiots who want to erase Thomas Jefferson and George Washington's names from public school buildings because they owned slaves.
I wonder if they also want to tear up the Declaration of Independence because Jefferson wrote it. You cannot judge historical events based on modern PC bullshit etiquette!

Actually, I can and do judge historical figures on the failings of their characters just as I do current public figures. Jefferson had some great ideas, but in action was often unable to live up to his own stated ideals. Washington was a great leader but was also, by most accounts, a total dick.

I don't want to rewrite history or judge everyone by contemporary standards, but I hate it when people act like the "founding fathers" were gods. They had flaws; some of them huge, gaping flaws and acts of downright stupidity. Some of them killed each other in duels over petty insults, for crying out loud. It was nothing short of amazing that they were collectively able to put together such a good foundation for government.

I haven't heard of the people you're talking about who want to remove Jefferson and Washington's names from public schools, but I do think they've had enough time in the sun that they don't need anything new named after them for a while.

From: mantis65 [mantis65]
Date: 1-May-2006 19:50

I just wanna see the goddamn woodcut.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

yes me too! and there better be Tentacles and school girls in sailor suits doing the decapitating or this wood cut is going to suck!
Any links to this evil masterpiece?

Wow I can�t believe they had a war and there was propaganda demonizing an enemy I haven�t see that since operation desert storm!

Anyway where the pictures

From: doneuclid [Don Euclid]
Date: 1-May-2006 20:16

I wish I could join the dogpile and yell "academic censorship!" I can't - as others have said here, I want to see the damn woodcut first. The Chinese folks were referring to the text (or calligraphy) in the image as being racist, not the picture itself. If that is the case, it is less like putting up images of the holocaust and more like putting up an SS propaganda poster! Still, I'm surprised that the course profs buckled under so easily. I think the Japanese professor is probably terrified of being tarred and feathered as a racist. Poor bastard.

Re: Inter-Asian Rivalries - You ain't joking, Mr. Junkie. I once had to listen to a Korean buddy of mine explain to me that "we aren't like the lesser Asians... you know, the Cambodians, Laotians, Vietnamese..." Draw whatever conclusions you wish. Just remember that a lot of immigrant Asian

From: doneuclid [Don Euclid]
Date: 1-May-2006 20:19

Never let your Asian buddy watch you write a Rotten post about your Asian buddy. Public Service Announcement. :P

From: aulduron [Aulduron]
Date: 1-May-2006 20:54

Like it or not, we're all racist to a degree. It's natural, it's self defense. Just don't be a jackass about it.

From: barghest [buck fush]
Date: 1-May-2006 21:15

I'm wondering if Romanians would object to that woodcut of Vlad Tepes dining under his impalement victims being included in a history book. You know the picture I mean, we've all seen it.

This people are being too touchy. Humanity has been doing horrible things to each other for the entire history of civilization and beyond. If anything, they should put in a woodcut of Chinese soldiers doing horrible things to Japanese civilians on the opposite page, I'm damned sure one could be found.

I'm of Irish descent, that doesn't mean I'm going to hate the English kid next to me in history class when we go over the potato famine. Hell, I'm of Cherokee descent too, that doesn't mean I'm going to get pissed off at the white kids when we cover the Trail of Tears. What are they afraid is going to happen? Sino-Nipponese donnybrook might break out in class?

>>>Boo fucking hoo china, you lost the war<<<

Oh, WOW. Holy shit. What war would that be, oh auspicious scholar? World War II? Are you saying that China lost World War II?

From: daveythedumbass [Davey the Dumbass]
Date: 1-May-2006 21:22

Anyone want to help donate a painting to MIT of the nuke going off over Nagasaki? It's American History, I'm sure people would understand the artistic merit of it. I even know an artist who I'm sure could depict burning Japanese women and children quite realistically.

From: mantis65 [mantis65]
Date: 1-May-2006 21:32

http://www.artelino.com/articles/japanese_war_prints.asp

These Pictures are pretty ! Haven�t found the decaps yet even if they are war pictures they would be very pretty. Some pretty cool art

From: genkimon [genkimon]
Date: 1-May-2006 22:02

>>>Boo fucking hoo china, you lost the war<<<

Oh, WOW. Holy shit. What war would that be, oh auspicious scholar? World War II? Are you saying that China lost World War II?
===================================================================

They were "on" the winning side, but in the same sense the French were, only the French were known to fight from time to time. Think about it - a country the size of the US, with a polutaion of 600,000,000 (at the time), meaning they easily outnumber the invading army by (conservatively) 200 to 1, and they surrendered about half their territory. The good half, the parts that had anything of any value. No campaign to retake lost land. No effective guerilla movement. No anything, aside from a lot of Chinese trying to make money by selling things to the Japanese Army. China's sole contribution to the war effort was providing a lot of real estate for the Japanese Army to park their troops in, thus keeping them from invading Australia or someplace else.

It was just part of the long, sad history of China rolling over when confronted with an invasion. They rolled over to the Manchurians twice, the Mongolians once, heck even Tibet kicked China's butt back in the middle ages!

But don't ever try to tell the Chinese this. They'll stick their fingers in their ears and start loudly going "LALALALALALALALALA!"

From: barghest [buck fush]
Date: 1-May-2006 22:40

Well, look at it from their perspective: China has been invaded hundreds of times, and the new Dynasty always collapses on its own and goes away. Waiting it out seems to be a strategy that works for them. Has for five thousand years. When the Mongols took over, they just shrugged, named it the Yuan dynasty, and waited it out. Hell, a lot of modern Chinese refer to Communism as the "Mao Dynasty", and are waiting it out, too. Hehehe.

Besides, if someone came into my country and perpetrated something as atrocious as the Rape of Nanking, I wouldn't want to fuck with them, either. Even for an Asian war--Asia having a history of especially grisly wars--that was some fucked-up shit.

I was mostly just shocked and amused (Shocused? Amucked?) that someone might have thought that China lost a major war in the modern era. Guy probably thinks the United States fought Russia and China in World War II to end Communism or something. (I can't really count the Opium Wars or the Boxer Rebellion, they just wouldn't meet the requirements for being able to say "Serves them right!")

I guess he might have meant that China lost the Cold War. But since China is still Communist, and has one of the world's fastest growing economies, and is a budding new superpower, and the U.S. owes them trillions of dollars in credit debt--I'd have to take a good long look at this guy's idea of victory conditions....

From: themedicated [The Medicated]
Date: 1-May-2006 23:31

I found a PHOTO...or some photos:

http://www.metroactive.com/papers/metro/12.12.96/cover/china1-9650.html

From: dipshitloser [andy]
Date: 1-May-2006 23:55

I enjoy
arguing about history, making rules, and pestering
people for arbitrary signifcant reasons that do the
world lots of symbolic good. Hey pc collegues,
lets go to the university and spend four years giving
each other intellectual erections and arguing with ourselves
and then when thats done, we can spend more years
avoiding work and marriage by getting a doctorate and PHD
and then we can become master wanker professors and
rip off naive college freshman so that they can spend the rest
of their lives in poorly paid service jobs having inconsolable debt.
Besides that, all those babyboomer old farts need to
know that there is an authority thinking about deep bullshit
for them. Now let me get some musk for my armpits and some
petchouli oil to hold my pony tail down. I have to wave
staple lots of signs up around campus and its important
that all those freshman girls notice my thirty year old ass.
Are these yellow tinted glasses and black
"fight racism" shirt appropriate? Not too unk, hippy or alternative?
When I make 1 K a year giving
lectures, I can support the Sierra club by flying in a kerosene belching
jet to the Amazon once a year to wave signs at cattle ranchers.
That will stop global emissions for sure. Better recylce my bottles
of Perrier and keep all those pesky RVs out of yosemite. Nobody who
has kids should be allowed to enjoy nature. Is it racist to say "ethnic
person"? My six year old logic needs more disguising with ambiguous
incomprehensible vocabulary. Maybe, tonight, I'll smoke a joint
with the PC board and we'll get really serious!

From: mcgyver [Steve]
Date: 2-May-2006 02:08

I'm not a racist..........I just fucking hate everybody.

From: kurekuretakora [oldgit]
Date: 2-May-2006 02:53

It might be racist,it might be offensive but it is also an historical artifact.How can you hope to understand history if you start leaving bits out ? I thought MIT was an educational esthablishment,are the students so dumb they can't find the information to put these pictures in context by themselves ?

From: brainspore [Brainspore]
Date: 2-May-2006 07:21

From: genkimon [genkimon]
Date: 1-May-2006 22:02

...But don't ever try to tell the Chinese this. They'll stick their fingers in their ears and start loudly going "LALALALALALALALALA!"

Genkimon, I'm disappointed in you. If you really wanted to make fun of Chinese people, you would have said:

They'll stick their fingers in their ears and start loudly going "RARARARARARARARARA!"

From: franksanbeans [Segundo]
Date: 2-May-2006 07:52

Hey Andy , nice post! By tonight there will be some holier than thou correcting your diction or spelling. I too have contempt for these fake intellectuals. I live within walking distance of Harvard square and see these types to often.

From: teratomarty [Self-made man]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:17

Is a little context too much to ask?

Uhh... it's on a history class website. I imagine they'd get the context if they just *took the class.*

By tonight there will be some holier than thou correcting your diction or spelling.

I'm a grammar fascist, but I make a point of only correcting the writing of people who produce asinine screed proclaiming their intellectual superiority. Basically, don't bring the intellectualism unless you can BRING the intellectualism. Andy's critiquing the academic approach, so his writing isn't really at issue. It's pretty good, anyway.

From: themedicated [The Medicated]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:23

More images:

http://wakingbear.com/PoliticalGems/japan3.htm

www.origami.no/stoptorture/images/japnbody.gif

http://www.princeton.edu/~nanking/html/image_9.html (<-remember to hit next to see more images.)

From: dittyd [dittyd]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:23

hey Andi, I really didn't want to do this, but hey, are you having fun, please forgive me:

Mott the Hoople and the Game of Life. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Andy Kaufman in the wrestling match. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Monopoly, twenty one, checkers, and chess. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Mister Fred Blassie in a breakfast mess. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Let's play Twister, let's play Risk. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
See you in heaven if you make the list. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

Hey Andy, did you hear about this one? Tell me, are you locked in the punch?
Hey Andy, are you goofing on Elvis? Hey baby, are we losing touch?
If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up his sleeve, then nothing is cool

Moses went walking with the staff of wood. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Newton got beaned by the apple good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Egypt was troubled by the horrible asp. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Mister Charles Darwin had the gall to ask. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

Hey Andy, did you hear about this one? Tell me, are you locked in the punch?
Hey Andy, are you goofing on Elvis? Hey baby, are you having fun?
If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up his sleeve, then nothing is cool

Here's a little agit for the never-believer. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Here's a little ghost for the offering. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Here's a truck stop instead of Saint Peter's. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
Mister Andy Kaufman's gone wrestling (wrestling bears). Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

Hey Andy, did you hear about this one? Tell me, are you locked in the punch?
Hey Andy, are you goofing on Elvis? Hey baby, are we losing touch?
If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up my sleeve, then nothing is cool

If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up his sleeve, then nothing is cool
If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up his sleeve, then nothing is cool
If you believed they put a man on the moon, man on the moon
If you believe there's nothing up his sleeve, then nothing is cool

d

From: wholeflaffer [Arthur Q. Wholeflaffer]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:24

Are the Japanese and the Chinese really of different races?

Isn't it more like the Apache and the Iroquois? Or the Serbs and the Bosnians?

From: genkimon [genkimon]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:29

Genkimon, I'm disappointed in you. If you really wanted to make fun of Chinese people, you would have said:

They'll stick their fingers in their ears and start loudly going "RARARARARARARARARA!"
==================================================================

Yes, but THAT would be the mark of an ignoramus. The Chinese language has both Rs and Ls, just like English ("lian" = lotus, "ren" = person, among dozens of other examples). Japanese, on the other hand, has neither Rs nor Ls, but a consonant sound romanized as "R", but pronounced in a way as to sound like an L to English speakers, only different. Some say it has a hint of D.

Besides, I don't need to spend energy making fun of the Chinese. All I have to do is point when anyone asks. Their "5000 years of culture" speaks for itself, and makes them look like idiots better than I ever could.

From: dittyd [dittyd]
Date: 2-May-2006 08:39

Mit so horny, mit love you long time.
(before anyone calls me a racist, I'll let you know I have a Chinese friend, (well I think he's Chinese, or something, he's yellow and smart, whatever) and a black friend (what's up Doczzz, word to your mother.))
d

From: absintheredux [Green Death]
Date: 2-May-2006 09:35

Here is the famous print and others

http://www.zonaeuropa.com/20060428_2.htm

It's too small to read the Kanji.

My best to MIT, my "alma mater", and my great sorrow that apologies were given for that which did not need them at all.

Should leave PC to Harvard (jk)

From: ciaochowbella [I didn't do it and I wasn't there when it happened]
Date: 2-May-2006 09:37

From: scumbagjunkie [junkiescumbag]
Date: 1-May-2006 12:41

Is a little context too much to ask?
------------------------
Stating that it was an image from a war that took place over 100 years ago should be context enough.

And people shouldn't be so fucking touchy. I'm a white southerner and the descendant of slave holders. While I don't agree with slave holding, I'm not going to get all bent out of shape because someone states the TRUTH about my ancestors. I never owned slaves so I am not guilty.

You don't pick your ancestors or your race. You can only learn from the mistakes of the past and make yourself better in the present.

From: scumbagjunkie [junkiescumbag]
Date: 2-May-2006 09:40

Is a little context too much to ask?

Uhh... it's on a history class website. I imagine they'd get the context if they just *took the class.*
==============================================================================
See above post, Mr. Smartypants. Running this story without an accompanying graphic is about as useful as pieces about the whole Mohammad cartoon thing without examples of said cartoons. "Journalists" have to learn how to stop being media wind-ups and how to actively be JOURNALISTS.

From: dinanyin [teggyname]
Date: 2-May-2006 10:12

From: gargoyle1 - Date: 1-May-2006 13:40
Boo fucking hoo china, you lost the war, live with it. Assbag crybabies

From: barghest [buck fush] - Date: 1-May-2006 21:15
�Oh, WOW. Holy shit. What war would that be, oh auspicious scholar? World War II? Are you saying that China lost World War II?

From: genkimon [genkimon] - Date: 1-May-2006 22:02
�They were "on" the winning side, but in the same sense the French were, only the French were known to fight from time to time. Think about it - a country the size of the US, with a polutaion of 600,000,000 (at the time), meaning they easily outnumber the invading army by (conservatively) 200 to 1, and they surrendered about half their territory. The good half, the parts that had anything of any value. No campaign to retake lost land. No effective guerilla movement. No anything, aside from a lot of Chinese trying to make money by selling things to the Japanese Army. China's sole contribution to the war effort was providing a lot of real estate for the Japanese Army to park their troops in, thus keeping them from invading Australia or someplace else. It was just part of the long, sad history of China rolling over when confronted with an invasion. They rolled over to the Manchurians twice, the Mongolians once, heck even Tibet kicked China's butt back in the middle ages!...

From: barghest [buck fush] - Date: 1-May-2006 22:40
�I guess he might have meant that China lost the Cold War. But since China is still Communist, and has one of the world's fastest growing economies, and is a budding new superpower, and the U.S. owes them trillions of dollars in credit debt--I'd have to take a good long look at this guy's idea of victory conditions....

HEY! barghest [buck fush] and genkimon [genkimon] - Do all of us a favor and please READ the article before posting!

"The Massachusetts Institute of Technology took down a history course Web page after Chinese students complained about a 19th century wood-print image of Japanese soldiers beheading Chinese prisoners. The complaints led to an apology from one of the professors teaching "Visualizing Cultures," which uses images from the Sino-Japanese War of 1894-1895."

Obviously NOT World War II. Or, at least obvious to those of us who actually bother to read the articles first.

Now who's the "auspicious scholar", hmmm???

From: mantis65 [mantis65]
Date: 2-May-2006 10:32

there pictures are he ones people bitched about? i have seen real Decapitations from Iraq And you want me to get mad over a pretty 100 year old wood cut?
Yes its bad yes its war crimes or what ever its also 100 year old news

From: simonjester [Bill Vojtech]
Date: 2-May-2006 11:53

From what I can gather from the article, there were racist comments about the Chinese in the Japanese woodcut's caption, and no explanation of the context on the website. So it could have been taken as an endorsement of the Japanese slaughter of the Chinese prisoners.

I would have added a paragraph explaining the context and left the image.

As for the profuse apology, forget about it.

From: barghest [buck fush]
Date: 2-May-2006 20:21

>>>Are the Japanese and the Chinese really of different races?<<<

Depends on what you mean by the very variable term 'race'.

The Japanese have interbred for thousands of years with the Ainu, the original native peoples of the Japanese islands (who are supposed to be particularly hairy). The Chinese have not. Of course, depending on how obtuse you want to be, you could also argue that Native Americans and Asians aren't a different race either, since the ancestors of the former came over from Asia on that land bridge and all.

Culture counts for something too, though. Their cultures are very different.

Wow, Genkimon has such an unreasoning and complete hatred of Chinese, I'd believe he was Japanese! Or maybe even Korean!

White people did not invent bigotry.